Monday 1 March 2010

Quality not quantity

Theoretically, how many members of an international team would it take to beat the average club side? By club, I mean the traditional sort with a couple of saturday XIs and a sunday team, not the Lancashire-League-with-an-overseas-pro type. 

I think the answer is four. A quartet made up of, for argument's sake,  Pietersen, Prior, Collingwood and Anderson would do it. They'd only have one fielder on either side of the wicket, but I think they would quite quickly bowl out a club team. You'd back them to get a few hundred runs too.

On a good day, they might even be able to win with three, a sobering notion...

10 comments:

Brit said...

If it was (a reasonably fit)Flintoff, Broad and Prior I'd bet on the 3.

With a keeper and one slip, Broad and Flintoff could bowl within themeselves at the top of off stump, throw in the occasional yorker and bouncer and reasonably expect to bowl out the club side for less than 50. Once they got the best 3 or 4 batsmen the rest would struggle to get a run between them.

After that it's just a question of whether the three of them knock off the runs. 9 times out of 10, yes.

On the other hand, if Flintoff and Prior batted first and made a hundred each, they could even do it with the two of them (and that's with Prior bowling from one end).

The Old Batsman said...

I've actually come round the the three theory overnight, too...

This actually started as a football debate. I think four pros could beat any club team, too. Seaman, Adams, Vieira, Henry being my selection...

Brit said...

Are you an Arsenal fan perchance?

With football its much harder to say than cricket, which is a "one-at-a-time" sport apart from the fielding, whereas 4 footballers would have to do a lot of running.

But yes, if you had two solid defenders and a keeper, the club side would struggle to score. Then you have a dribbler up front to take them on on his own. Torres or Ronaldo or Messi, say, would score lots of goals solo - especially in the second half when the club side would tire first despite having 7 extra outfield players...

Brit said...

Btw - doesn't the thought experiment really boil down to this: what separates the levels in cricket is the ability to play fast bowling.

Aything accurate above, say, 80mph would be nigh impossible for amateurs to deal with. A good game would be to set a club team a target of 20, no fielders except a wicket keeper, and have Anderson or Broad bowl nothing but fast yorkers.

Ceci said...

Forgive me for asking - but how would club cricketers cope with an international spinner - Swann springs to mind. Is there such a chasm between amateur and professional here?

Tom Redfern said...

The number of international and first class players I've seen humbled in club cricket- friendly and league matches casts doubt on your theory.

You should have seen Grant Elliot at Gerrard's Cross a few years ago.
Paul Harris was rubbish when he played in the Hants league- I'm told.

Ceci, Graeme Swann would not frighten anyone in league cricket- a good league.

But that said, I reckon that two bowlers, Tommo and Lillee, Waqar and Wasim, Marshall and anyone would be enough to beat a composite sat/sunday XI.

Brit said...

I think would be a bit like bowling against a team entirely composed of pro number 11s (or much worse from the club number 6 down). They might make a few runs against even top-quality medium pace or spin but Dale Steyn would clean the whole side up within a few overs.

This does actually happen in real life where you get a massive mismatch. I once played in a game where a single fast bowler took 9 wickets and bowled our entire team out for a total of 11 runs, simply by bowling at the stumps at a pace we'd never seen before.

Brit said...

The bastard who got out to the kiddie at the other end never lived it down.

The Old Batsman said...

Ceci - good question: about 10 years ago I had the chance to face Phil Tufnell in the nets, for about 20 mins. The biggest difference between him and a club spinner was not the turn but the dip and drift. Everything he bowled seemed to pitch just before you expected it to. Afterwards, while I was still sweating, he happily explained how Mark Waugh didn't think he could bowl at all, and refused to do anything except try and smash every ball...

Tom - yes, that's why I was trying to make a distinction between a good league and just a club side. Still, four Test players would give a league side a game, I'm sure.

Tim Newman said...

A combination of Lee, Gilchrist, and Warne would have demolished most teams. Warne and Gilly could probably do it alone were Warne allowed to bowl from both ends and Big Ears keeps the gloves on.